Mr. Caspar Peek Country Director of the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA) in Belarus, the Representative of the UNFPA in Ukraine visited Minsk in April with the first working visit. Meetings were held in the Ministries of Foreign Affairs, Internal Affairs, Health, Education, Labour and Social protection, National statistical Committee and other departments. The prospects of cooperation within the new UNFPA Country Program for 2016-2020 years, approved by the Council of Ministers, were discussed at these meetings. BELTA made an exclusive interview with the UN diplomat, discussed directions of cooperation between UNFPA and Belarus, and also talked about family values, divorces, ageing with dignity, retirement age extension and gender equality.
- Mr. Caspar Peek, what issues were discussed during your visit to Belarus?
- In recent years, the collaboration with UNFPA has been significantly intensified: the Fund has assisted in the preparation for the population census, implements important projects to increase the efficiency of demographic policy, prevention of domestic violence and strengthening of reproductive health. In March this year, the Council of Ministers approved the UNFPA Country Program for Belarus for 2016-2020, which focuses on three main areas: reproductive health; gender equality and empowerment of women; population dynamics. In fact, UNFPA opens a new cycle of cooperation with Belarus. UNFPA has established reliable partnership relations with many ministries and departments. The meetings dealt with the improvement of the implemented programs.
- One of the issues on which attention is focused, - is combating domestic violence.
In recent years, Belarus has done ambitious work on the development of legislation, the improvement of sensitivity of the state officials and awareness of the public about the problem of domestic violence, and support of non-governmental organizations, working in this field. The aggression comes from men in 86% of cases, most of the victims are women. This gives ground to speak about gender-based violence, which can’t be prevented only by legislative methods, - you need to change the mentality of the society. For example, you can set a directive that poverty is illegal. But it will not lead to the elimination of poverty! It requires the combined efforts of legislators, law enforcement, doctors, teachers, social workers, NGOs, to ensure that people have learned building a life without use of physical, psychological, sexual or economic violence to their loved ones. Figuratively speaking, the violence must be "non grata" in the thoughts and actions of each person.
-As you are the UNFPA representative in Ukraine, It will be interesting to compare the assessment of the situation with combating domestic violence in Ukraine and Belarus.
- In both countries, unfortunately, domestic violence is a very serious problem. The people from Belarus and Ukraine have similar behavior patterns because of a common historical past. But the response actions to domestic violence are significantly different: in Ukraine civil society is more developed, in Belarus Sate is more active. What is more efficient? It's hard to say, it requires a symbiosis. Because innovations in the legal field depend on the governmental authorities and civil society awareness of the problem from the inside, being closer to the people, the families. Domestic violence differs from other types of offenses. For example, if someone was hit, the perpetrator will be punished immediately. But if an aggressor hit his wife, child, mother or father, it often remains a family secret, a private affair. The victims must overcome internal hostility, trust completely to law enforcement agencies, and to specialists from other departments in order to publicize the situation of violence. This trust is earned not so simple, and people's awareness of legal protection methods is still low, so the victims prefer to keep silence or contact NGOs. A great achievement of Belarus is understanding that the problem of domestic violence has to be solved in cooperation between the State and Society.
- Family violence is one of the factors leading to divorces. But it’s not the only one. Our country has a high divorce rate, though this rate has gradually reduced in recent years. How can we minimize divorces and situations, when children grow in incomplete families?
-I think high divorce rate is a result of changing lifestyles. A number of those women who want to stay married if they are unhappy decreases. We should admit that women at this time have more economic opportunities than before, and they believe it is better to divorce and move forward. The problem is that men do not do their role properly. There are insufficient efforts to maintain the material welfare of the family: the abuse of alcohol, infidelity, jealousy, avoiding household responsibilities and upbringing of children, insufficient efforts to maintain the family's material well-being... You have to admit that previously women almost never left their families in such situations. And now they decide to divorce more often than men. That is the statistics. I suppose the reasons for the growing number of divorces is clear to everybody, but it’s no clear how to solve it. We can not just say to women: don't get divorced! They don't have to make such sacrifices, it's their life, their decision. Moreover, the men do not go for them to make sacrifices… In my opinion, it is very important to develop a network of family workers and psychologists. In some situations, the advice of experts can return harmony to families. But there is no magic recipe for a happy life, we need diligent collaboration of men and women. And as it seems to me, it is necessary to educate a new generation of people with new communication skills. I admit that men go for conversation harder than women. I'm a man, I know it. Look at kids in kindergarten. If there is any problem, girls begin talking about it, arguing, proving something. But they do not hit each other. And boys in this situation often begin to fight. This scheme of solving problems originates from childhood and appears in adult life. People don't know how to "speak" the problem in a timely manner before the situation gradually comes to a standstill. We need to bring the children from an early age the notion that men and women are equal (currently family roles are unbalanced). It is no doubt that we can't expect the immediate result. For example, in Scandinavia, Germany, Holland everyone carries his burden of family responsibilities, and for this particular reason, there are fewer divorces than in other countries. In recent years, young people are not in a hurry to get married.
I have two daughters aged 24 and 27. They say: I'd rather not marry at all than marry a wrong man... I got married after three months dating, and we've been married 28 years. Today, many young couples are in "premarital" state within 5-10 years, married and break up soon. Marriage is a hard work from both man and woman, isn't it? It should be recognized that young people do not want to take on responsibility and additional burden that accompanies marriage. When I worked in Thailand, we conducted research on marriage, trying to figure out why young people are less likely to get married. One of the arguments of girls against marriage is additional domestic work (cooking, cleaning of house, washing, taking care of the husband's relatives, etc.). As a result, women have shorter career, fewer opportunities for self-realization.
-Referring to the fact that a man earns more than a woman (in Belarus - about a third), he is given a function of a breadwinner. This "justifies" his isolation from family and parental responsibilities. Maybe it's time to initiate a mandatory dad's leave or at least to prepare society for the fact that it's a matter of time? According to the Labour code, childcare leave until the age of three may be granted not only to a woman but also to a working father or other relatives of a child, actually taking care of him, with a monthly allowance.But few men take this opportunity…
- Yes, in some countries the mandatory dad's leave for childcare is practiced. But fathers are free to decide how many days to spend with the baby. It is very important to educate conscious paternity in men and not to force them. Otherwise "unripe" fathers instead of child care will play Golf or drink beer at the bar. Joint parenting of mother and father are actually strengthening a marriage. In addition, if a father begins caring about a child in his/her early age, so he will pay more attention to his child in the future. There is a Spanish proverb: a rooster is tied to a roost by a hen, not by chicks, but if there are no chicks, then the rooster will not be tied to the roost.
- How do you estimate the situation with gender equality in Belarus?
The issue of gender inequality is the question of power, rooted in the historical traditions (exclusively men possessed the power in the past). It is well known that women in Belarus are better educated than men. But there are still not so many women in the key positions such as government, parliament, big business. The ration of female representation is far from 50-50. In some countries research was carried out on the topic of women's representation at different levels of decision-making. It is interesting that, when they were offered to make a choice, who will be in charge, both men and women gave preference to male bosses. It is the result of stereotypes of female managers, top women managers. The idea that women are less capable and effective in the public sphere than men endures through years.
- So maybe it makes sense to introduce quotas, as it has already been practiced in some countries, in both spheres: politics and business?
-You are talking about the so-called positive discrimination. It works in some countries, but not everywhere. For example, in Ukraine, there is a parliamentary quota for women, but it’s never been filled.
-Belarus has taken a decision to gradually raisethe retirement age by three years with the preservation of gender five-year age difference thresholds. How does this correspond to the global trends?
-Many countries move towards raising age of retirement because of ageing population and low fertility. Somewhere gender difference persists, somewhere it gradually decreases, somewhere the pension thresholds have already been equalized. Each country has its own distinct characteristics of demographic, socio-economic situation and forecasts of its development. I want to emphasize that raising the retirement age should be linked to the employability: leaving the older generation in the workplace, we reduce employment opportunities for young people. Therefore, it is necessary to calculate and implement measures to prevent the growth of unemployment. And there is another very important aspect that, in my opinion, has received less attention than it deserves: creation of jobs with high added value. For the state and society it is better, for example, if a 60-year-old engineer does not retire, but is working few more years (if he is healthy) because his productivity is much higher than of a 25-year-old engineer. But the productivity of a young loader is higher than of a 60-year-old colleague. You see, the point isn't the retirement age, but the productivity of labour in specific age at a specific workplace. By the way, for UN staff age of retirement is 62 years, and there are plans to increase it. And there are no age limitations for the highest UN posts. The UN are not an exception. For example, in many countries judges do not retire - their experience is so rich, and qualification is so high, that to let them retire at 60 or 65 years old would be unreasonable. Considering gender difference in age of retirement, if you are going to develop positive trends towards a more equitable distribution of family responsibilities, the gender pension difference in the future will be reduced. But still women carry a double burden everywhere: at work and at home. A lower threshold of retirement is a kind of bonus for it. But time does not stand still, changes are inevitable. A couple of decades ago we could not imagine that a woman could be a minister of defence, head of government and a parliamentarian. And it is a reality now. Next head of the United Nations may become a woman for the first time in history. And it is not perceived as something extraordinary. Girls living in a modern world, see other role models, their perception is changing, as well as of boys. Sometimes we underestimate the public influence, but young people absorb everything like a sponge, create idols, imitate them. It's important that public people show that both women and men can reach success. And that all depends not on gender, but personal qualities of a person.
– From your point of view, what are the strongest demographic threats in Belarus?
- UNFPA believes motherhood is a key aspect of the development of society. The first priority of any civilized society is investing in the well-being of a mother. However, the state will never be able to "buy" (it’s about families support measures) as many children as it needs for population growth, but is forced to invest significant resources into reproductive potential. The birth rate in Belarus increases (including through the implementation of stimulating measures), but it is still low. The same situation is also in other countries. In my opinion, the solution to demographic problems is achieving a balance of productive and reproductive roles. If it is problematic to increase birth rate, then you need to raise, figuratively speaking, the quality of the young generation. I worked in several countries with low birth rate, and it is not a disaster, when human capital rate is high. There are only 300 thousand inhabitants in Luxembourg, and the quality of life is much higher there than in countries with millions of inhabitants. In Singapore, the population decreases every year, as the country gets richer and richer. What's the secret? It’s the high potential of the young generation (lawyers, engineers, economists, computer programmers, solicitors etc.). Their work is highly paid, their pension fund contributions are high, and this solves the problem of supporting the older generation. Knowledge creates wealth. The second threat is related to the increase in life expectancy - people are living longer, to some extent it's very good, but their health is not that strong, and therefore it’s required to provide additional funding for health and social services. Of course, the state should ensure the implementation of its social commitments to the older generation, but it can’t regain the health of the elderly. In China there is a saying: we're growing old sooner than get rich. You need to understand that if you want to be rich at old age, you need to protect your health at young age. A healthy lifestyle is a key to the prosperity of a particular person, a society, and a state in general.
